I said there was an argument. And you have showed your closed mind and maybe a questionable moral outlook on life by not even considering alternatives. Here is the argument: since unborn children are human then killing them is wrong. A person has the right to defend themselves and others from serious phyisical harm or death. Since abortion doctors are killing the unborn children killing the abortion doctors is justifiable.
A person has the right to defend themselves and others from serious phyisical harm or death. Since abortion doctors are killing the unborn children killing the abortion doctors is justifiable.
thats not a valid argument. it'd be valid were it the mother or the unborn child killing the abortion doctor. but i've not heard of such an occurrence.
by justifying the killing of abortion doctors, you yourself are showing a questionable moral outlook on life.
and just so you know, i am against abortion as the means of birth control it has become. however, i also realise that if its made illegal, it will still happen, under unsafe conditions, where you not only lose the life of the unborn child, but often the life of the mother as well.
No not at all. You are bringing into question the morality of the abortion provider. If he is killing a human, under the self defense doctrine he can and should be stopped.
Self-Defense is not limited to protection by family memebers.
surely you don't believe that if you were being attacked, i saw it, and killed the attacker i could claim self-defence. defence of you, perhaps, but definitely not self-defence.
personally, i don't consider the fetus to be a separate life until its able to live outside the womb, with or without life support equipment, which is why i'll side with you on partial-birth abortions. the child at that point is very much able to survive outside the womb.
surely you don't believe that if you were being attacked, i saw it, and killed the attacker i could claim self-defence. defence of you, perhaps, but definitely not self-defence.
Yes you could it is a sub issue of self defense,if you want to get technical. A person has the right to defend others.
personally, i don't consider the fetus to be a separate life until its able to live outside the womb, with or without life support equipment, which is why i'll side with you on partial-birth abortions. the child at that point is very much able to survive outside the womb. Whether an unborn child can survive outside the womb is irrlevant. It is a fact that abortionists throw out to confuse the fuzzy thinking masses. The question is "is the child human?" If so what gives anyone the right to end their life?
New findings reveal that underage drinkers account for a quarter of all alcohol consumption in America.
One-third of high school students regularly binge drink.
Ninth-grade girls are as likely to imbibe as boys.
Why does this massive problem exist?
Has much of an entire generation turned away from God?
Are our nation's parents incompetent, hypocritical role models?
Is our society so alienatingly messed up that it elicits increasing levels of dysfunctional rebellion from kids?
Has our system turned into a Moloch-monster devouring its young?
Here's a big part of it:
The most popular rock stations in our town (and undoubtedly in yours as well) incessantly advertise local clubs and other watering holes in the most glamorous, exciting light. But who listens to those stations? Countless kids way beneath the legal limit. Some of those bars feature "dry nights", which are a kind of pre-legal "training" and acclimazation for future boozing.
Just another example of how greed, and accompanying social irresponsibility, have put our society on the slick skids to oblivion.
Every older generation looks upon the wildness of the young as a sign of civilization's certain end.
But, of course, the elder critics were pretty "loose" in their prime, as well.
And then there's the utter counterproductiveness of trying to force rectifying, moralistic change.
It just spurs further rebellion.
As well it should.
The whole hippie phenomenon -- the counter culture of the '60s -- was largely a liberating reaction to the stultifying, conservative "values" imposed particularly during the Eisenhower era.
But there's a point where healthy and necessary iconoclasm crosses over to become just so much destructive petty self-indulgence.
Caligulan hedonism.
Especially in an environment where negatives are enforced by standard-operating-procedure excesses such as those that characterize the Enron obscenity.
Are we at such a point in America today?
Maybe not.
Maybe other societies surpass our depravity.
But life in these times, in this place, sure feels...dirty.
Have they no shame? Here's yet the latest example of why the Democrats are notorious as the party of election fraud:
Dems now want to sabotage an agreed-upon photo ID requirement for first-time voters, threatening to unravel a bipartisan Senate accord to overhaul election procedures, the Associated Press reported today.
An amendment by Sens. Charles Schumer, D-N.Y., and Ron Wyden, D-Ore., would instead allow voters to "guarantee" their identities merely by signature!
The proposed amendment would make it "easier to vote and easier to cheat" and "effectively guts the anti-fraud provisions," noted Sen. Kit Bond, R-Mo.
A new poll conducted in several Islamic countries finds that Muslims overwhelmingly regard American policy toward them as "arrogant and ruthless".
You must be kidding ? That can't be right, Muslims overwhelmingly dislike Americans or their policy? NO, say it aint so Dennis, damn, there go the family vaction plans to Pakistan. We thought maybe we would go and try to interview some of those poor oprressed but rich middle class terrorists. I sure hope they don't kdnap, torture and slit our throats because of our religion or country.
Needless to say, George Bush doesn't get high approval ratings.
He does here ! but damn, There goes the Iranian vote.
Are those survey respondents wrong?
YEP, BIG TIME.
If not, how can our heavy-handed, intensely propagandized, misdirected "war on terrorism" possibly succeed?
Yes and many of the lies and propaganda coming from Superior WI.
We've just been digging ourselves into a hole since 9/11.
No Dennis, THEY dug the hole. It's where the f---ing world trade center used to be. But you're right. Let's negotiate and try to be reasonable with people like this, maybe if we just sit down and have a coke with them and try to listen to their side they will listen to us and they can tell us why they are mad. That's what Daniel Pearl tried to do and it got him tortured and murdered because he was American and Jewish. They are nothing but evil and murderous, no matter the reason. You fail to see that sometimes people are just evil and wrong but instead try to blame it on the U.S. You are an apologist for pure evil. Right I know Dennis, you think their acts were horrible, right o.k we got it. But of course everytime we turn around instead of telling us how wrong they are and how evil they are you look for a reason to blame us even more or find reason in their insanity. They are evil plain and simple. But keep looking at it from their point of view I'm sure people apologized or reasoned that the Nazi's were opresssed as well.
Yes Dennis it's a good thing you are worried what muslims think of America seeing what great and reasonable folks these people seem to be.
A.P Wed Feb 27th 2002
A Muslim mob set fire to a train carrying Hindu nationalists home from a disputed religious site today, killing at least 57 people, officials said. Fearing religious strife could spread, the prime minister appealed for calm. The fire gutted four coaches in the early morning attack at a station in the western city of Godhra, where Muslims angered by slogans chanted by the Hindus stoned the train cars and doused them with kerosene, according to state officials and witnesses.
See Dennis, just like the U.S they invited attack because they angered the muslim mob. They were chanting slogans I wonder what the muslims attitude in the polls was towards the hindu's ? If only the hindu's tried to listen and respect thier feelings it wouldn't happen. It must have been thier fault. Poor opressed mob.
Shall we now mount up for an anti-Islamic global pogrom?
It is the stubborn unwillingness -- no, the myth-believing, prejudice-saturated inability -- of that class of Americans who wield power and shape policy, always in the selfish interest of economic elites to which they themselves are profitably tied, to see that the United States is inflicting a massive, international injustice and an infuriating affront on particularly Third World humanity...that GUARANTEES that we will only grow more hated by more people around the planet as our haughty hegemonism spreads.
Poisonously.
Perniciously.
Perhaps you saw the piece on the evening news last night how anti-Americanism is rapidly growing in Afghanistan.
People there are seeing that America has an agenda wholly different than that which Washington has piously professed, and which works at ultimately vicious cross purposes with legitimate Afghani aspirations.
Vietstan, shaping up.
And not just there, but everywhere we think we know what's best, and that the imposition of our "model" is what the locals need.
I don't know, and you don't know the level of like or dislike of Americans in Afghanistan. But what if the American contingency along with the newly formed government decided today that a vast mistake has been made; and they have decided to turn the government back over to the Taliban? Do you think the Afghan people would be happier with that?
You talk about being "prejudice saturated." From what I recall of the two videotapes from Osama bin Laden and from his statements in the past, he practices religious prejudice to the extreme. Americans are infidels and the US preesence in Saudi Arabia is an affront to Islam. You talk about your bigotry? -- there it is, writ large. The Madrassas in Pakistan instill intense religious hatred for non-Muslims.
I defy you to say there is anything comperable in the United States.
Oh, but the US is arrogant. That and prosperous.
You don't need to look as far to find an "infuriating affront." They're still cleaning one up in New York. And it's not mythical.
Because you posted the article and laughed, and when queried about it, laughed again. Now you've been queried again and you're being coy. If you're not interested in answering, say so. I'm not curious enough to follow up any more.
Shall we now mount up for an anti-Islamic global pogrom?
Oh, sorry Dennis, I wouldn't want to offend the people who killed 57 Hindu's because they angered them. It's not anti Islamic, it's anti murderous thug. It's anti evil. I don't care what religious persuasion someone is as long as they aren't killing people in the name of that religion. It doesn't make all muslims bad. It makes the murderous thugs who would do deeds like that and 9-11 that need to be dealt with. If they are willing to do that to us and 57 Hindu's because they didn't like them you can't negoitiate with these people. They are evil. Something you seem quite prepared to continuously apologize for.
Dennis, This b.s myth you perpatrate about the terrorists being poor opressed people is a joke. Most of them were middle to upper middle class people who had access to travel and studied abroad. I point out a story about 57 Hindu's killed by muslim extremists and instead of condemming that you continue to pile on. I am sure you do condemn it but used it as another anti U.S diatribe and cry in your oatmeal about big evil business interests. But not a WORD about the 57 Hindu's killed. And you are worried about Muslim approval ratings for the U.S in countries such as that ? Yes Dennis they hate us for different reasons. But hey let's negotiate with people willing to hate and kill Hindu's because they dislike or disagree with them. They give us or would give us and have given us the same treatment. Keep apologizing for evil Dennis, It's apologists like you who are blinded by your own dislike for your government. And fail to see or deny that some people are just evil.
We were struck on 9/11 because we're deeply hated by much of the world.
The United States was the target, not Switzerland or Canada, or any other country.
That targeted enmity stems from an nderstandably profound resentment toward self-serving "Yankee" foreign policy -- a historically unequaled imperialism that takes, never gives, is perpetually demanding, and forecloses all possibilities for independent, native choice or development.
It's either have the sharp-edged American paradigm shoved down your throats...or watch out for the Marines, the CIA, the b-52's, and the cruise missiles!
Changing this abysmal, intolerable arrogance would not be "appeasing" an enemy.
It would constitute doing the objectively and universally right thing -- and winning sufficient friends for America that terrorists would have no basis for popular appeal.
We absolutely need to admit our prior, pivotal role in inflaming the sensibilities of peoples around the planet who have their own, valid values and traditions, and who don't want anything to do with Britney Spears or Joe Camel.
We must curb our outrageously offensive economic/ideological/political/cultural Coca-colonization of humankind.
If we don't, we'll be attacked, again and again and again.
We can't win without being right (nor should we expect to), and the everyday, negative impact of our global behavior on multitudinous millions across the planet is THE worst WRONG of our time.
It's not for nothing that we're seen as the Great Satan on such a huge scale.
The Third World's human and natural wealth -- its lifeblood -- fuels Western prosperity, and nations with proud links to rich civilations and glorious traditions are being forced to become Junior America's, with degrading imposition of all of our own decaying society's attitudes and assumptions.
No, the terrorist aren't right.
But, at levels two or three tiers below, where mass consciousness boils, we are justly and properly condemned for our greed and meddling.
Please try to look past Old Glory binding your eyes.
See what we're doing, and how our own country's safety and very viability will be grievously undercut if remedial change isn'timplemented.
We were struck on 9/11 because we're deeply hated by much of the world.
The United States was the target, not Switzerland or Canada, or any other country.
That targeted enmity stems from an nderstandably profound resentment toward self-serving "Yankee" foreign policy -- a historically unequaled imperialism that takes, never gives, is perpetually demanding, and forecloses all possibilities for independent, native choice or development.
It's either have the sharp-edged American paradigm shoved down your throats...or watch out for the Marines, the CIA, the b-52's, and the cruise missiles!
Changing this abysmal, intolerable arrogance would not be "appeasing" an enemy.
It would constitute doing the objectively and universally right thing -- and winning sufficient friends for America that terrorists would have no basis for popular appeal.
We absolutely need to admit our prior, pivotal role in inflaming the sensibilities of peoples around the planet who have their own, valid values and traditions, and who don't want anything to do with Britney Spears or Joe Camel.
We must curb our outrageously offensive economic/ideological/political/cultural Coca-colonization of humankind.
If we don't, we'll be attacked, again and again and again.
We can't win without being right (nor should we expect to), and the everyday, negative impact of our global behavior on multitudinous millions across the planet is THE worst WRONG of our time.
It's not for nothing that we're seen as the Great Satan on such a huge scale.
The Third World's human and natural wealth -- its lifeblood -- fuels Western prosperity, and nations with proud links to rich civilations and glorious traditions are being forced to become Junior America's, with degrading imposition of all of our own decaying society's attitudes and assumptions.
No, the terrorist aren't right.
But, at levels two or three tiers below, where mass consciousness boils, we are justly and properly condemned for our greed and meddling.
Please try to look past Old Glory binding your eyes.
See what we're doing, and how our own country's safety and very viability will be grievously undercut if remedial change isn't implemented.
That targeted enmity stems from an nderstandably profound resentment toward self-serving "Yankee" foreign policy -- a historically unequaled imperialism that takes, never gives, is perpetually demanding, and forecloses all possibilities for independent, native choice or development.
Never gives ? We have no foreign aid ? Send no peace corp workers ? Is it always self serving ? To you maybe it is. So we never help any one other than us ? we never do anything because it's the right thing to do?
>Changing this abysmal, intolerable arrogance would not be "appeasing" an enemy. It would constitute doing the objectively and universally right thing -- and winning sufficient friends for America that terrorists would have no basis for popular appeal.
Terrorists have popular appeal now ? so what should we do. Pull out of every country ?become isolationist again ? (we tried that once rremember)Send a check and say here you go, we won't ask anything or expect anything in return. What is your suggestion. It's easy to criticize but i would be interested to hear your solution.
We can't win without being right (nor should we expect to), and the everyday, negative impact of our global behavior on multitudinous millions across the planet is THE worst WRONG of our time. Â Â
The worst wrong of our time ? Really Dennis, You don't think ohhh the massacres in Rawanda or genocide in the Balkans might just be up there ?
We must curb our outrageously offensive economic/ideological/political/cultural Coca-colonization of humankind.
Many of the terrorists were from Saudi Arabia. We were invited there, they sell their oil voulintarily. Many of the companies that do business around the globe do so because people in those countries buy thier products. Many of those companies provide jobs that otherwise would not be there. Are they all without sin or abuse, no way. But what you fail to see is that many many in these countries aspire to have what we have been blessed with. as much as it pains you, the truth is that democracy and capatalism is the foundation of why we are where we are today. I know spare me the evil corporate anti capatalist rant. the truth is that capatalism has allowed us to flourish. No other country has rivaled in history the prosperity we have for all it's imperfections we are the most prosperous nation on earth. Some simply resent that. But why is it that many come from these other countries risking their lives in many cases to do so. So what will make these other nations prosperous ? tyranical communist, socailist, facist, fanatacist rule ? closed government? no freedom? How do these nations become more viable ? the systems they have had over the last 500 years haven't done it. What's wrong with supporting that?
Look. It would be one thing if we could negotiate, reason or even have dialouge with these people. China is willing to listen and adress human rights abuses through economic and diplomatic pressure and visa versa. But Dennis, we arent dealing with a formal government or sane rationale people we can have dialouge with. It's brought about by fanatical extremists who wish to rule the world as they see it. It comes down to who's right or who's wrong / Who's more evil, who's less evil? I think we know which side you think that is.
Dennis, Double posts happen from time to time and as for the typos ? Don't ever apologize to anyone on this bored fort the typin airors. Thaks spel czech
Just a hobby THX, I am working right now to finish my private lisc and want to get my I.F.R rating. I wish it was for a living that's my dream job. Actually it's been a passion since I was a kid. My Gandfather was a B-17 pilot in WW2 and flew professionally it got me interested in it. I love it, hence the name. Unfortunatley it's not a cheap hobby so I get some hours in trade and have to save up in between to get hours in. It's a blast.
I said there was an argument. And you have showed your closed mind and maybe a questionable moral outlook on life by not even considering alternatives. Here is the argument: since unborn children are human then killing them is wrong. A person has the right to defend themselves and others from serious phyisical harm or death. Since abortion doctors are killing the unborn children killing the abortion doctors is justifiable.
A person has the right to defend themselves and others from serious phyisical harm or death. Since abortion doctors are killing the unborn children killing the abortion doctors is justifiable.
thats not a valid argument. it'd be valid were it the mother or the unborn child killing the abortion doctor. but i've not heard of such an occurrence.
by justifying the killing of abortion doctors, you yourself are showing a questionable moral outlook on life.
and just so you know, i am against abortion as the means of birth control it has become. however, i also realise that if its made illegal, it will still happen, under unsafe conditions, where you not only lose the life of the unborn child, but often the life of the mother as well.
No not at all. You are bringing into question the morality of the abortion provider. If he is killing a human, under the self defense doctrine he can and should be stopped.
What is called Black History Month might more accurately be called "the sins of white people" month.
Self-Defense is not limited to protection by family memebers.
surely you don't believe that if you were being attacked, i saw it, and killed the attacker i could claim self-defence. defence of you, perhaps, but definitely not self-defence.
personally, i don't consider the fetus to be a separate life until its able to live outside the womb, with or without life support equipment, which is why i'll side with you on partial-birth abortions. the child at that point is very much able to survive outside the womb.
surely you don't believe that if you were being attacked, i saw it, and killed the attacker i could claim self-defence. defence of you, perhaps, but definitely not self-defence.
Yes you could it is a sub issue of self defense,if you want to get technical. A person has the right to defend others.
personally, i don't consider the fetus to be a separate life until its able to live outside the womb, with or without life support equipment, which is why i'll side with you on partial-birth abortions. the child at that point is very much able to survive outside the womb. Whether an unborn child can survive outside the womb is irrlevant. It is a fact that abortionists throw out to confuse the fuzzy thinking masses. The question is "is the child human?" If so what gives anyone the right to end their life?
HEHEHEHEHEHEHEHEHEHHHE.....
HEHEHEHEHEHEHEHEHEHHHE.....
And?
HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAH......
Good comeback.
New findings reveal that underage drinkers account for a quarter of all alcohol consumption in America.
One-third of high school students regularly binge drink.
Ninth-grade girls are as likely to imbibe as boys.
Why does this massive problem exist?
Has much of an entire generation turned away from God?
Are our nation's parents incompetent, hypocritical role models?
Is our society so alienatingly messed up that it elicits increasing levels of dysfunctional rebellion from kids?
Has our system turned into a Moloch-monster devouring its young?
Here's a big part of it:
The most popular rock stations in our town (and undoubtedly in yours as well) incessantly advertise local clubs and other watering holes in the most glamorous, exciting light.
But who listens to those stations? Countless kids way beneath the legal limit. Some of those bars feature "dry nights", which are a kind of pre-legal "training" and acclimazation
for future boozing.
Just another example of how greed, and accompanying social irresponsibility, have put our society on the slick skids to oblivion.
Dennis:
Two weeks ago, I was in Cologne, Germany, during Carnival.
You want to see a drinkin' culture? It wasn't like Mardi Gras, which has turned into spring break.
This was young and old. Reeling drunk.
I don't know if I have a point, here but I hadn't seen a party like that in years.
Every older generation looks upon the wildness of the young as a sign of civilization's certain end.
But, of course, the elder critics were pretty "loose" in their prime, as well.
And then there's the utter counterproductiveness
of trying to force rectifying, moralistic change.
It just spurs further rebellion.
As well it should.
The whole hippie phenomenon -- the counter culture of the '60s -- was largely a liberating reaction to the stultifying, conservative "values" imposed particularly during the Eisenhower era.
But there's a point where healthy and necessary
iconoclasm crosses over to become just so much
destructive petty self-indulgence.
Caligulan hedonism.
Especially in an environment where negatives are
enforced by standard-operating-procedure excesses
such as those that characterize the Enron obscenity.
Are we at such a point in America today?
Maybe not.
Maybe other societies surpass our depravity.
But life in these times, in this place, sure feels...dirty.
HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAH......
What's so funny, Jethro?
Have they no shame? Here's yet the latest example of why the Democrats are notorious as the party of election fraud:
Dems now want to sabotage an agreed-upon photo ID requirement for first-time voters, threatening to unravel a bipartisan Senate accord to overhaul election procedures, the Associated Press reported today.
An amendment by Sens. Charles Schumer, D-N.Y., and Ron Wyden, D-Ore., would instead allow voters to "guarantee" their identities merely
by signature!
The proposed amendment would make it "easier to vote and easier to cheat" and "effectively guts the anti-fraud provisions," noted Sen. Kit Bond, R-Mo.
A new poll conducted in several Islamic countries finds that Muslims overwhelmingly regard American policy toward them as "arrogant and ruthless".
Needless to say, George Bush doesn't get high approval ratings.
Are those survey respondents wrong?
If not, how can our heavy-handed, intensely propagandized, misdirected "war on terrorism" possibly succeed?
We've just been digging ourselves into a hole since 9/11.
No, I'll take that back.
MANY holes, in several locales across the world.
Want to find Osama?
He'll be the dude in the crowd with the biggest grin on his face.
"He'll be the dude in the crowd with the biggest grin on his face."
The grin of someone self-destructively dilusional. His war machine collapses a little more every day.
He took down a lot of people, Dennis. He's a sad, evil man with a dark soul.
I don't know how you can say the things you do.,
I think we'll be seeing a lot of democrat votes with the signatures of MICKEY MOUSE & BILL CLINTON.
Now, in our time of crisis, helpfully comes former President Jimmy Carter to pronounce that the current president--this would be the president who actually has the job at the moment as opposed to the president who set a record for incompetence that will stand until the seas run dry when he did have the job, and has been tediously nattering away at his infinitely superior successors ever since--has erred.
There was nothing dramatic about Jimmy Carter's single term, just a vacuous collapse in the face of forces he never saw the point of resisting. He did follow a balanced policy: When he wasn't wishy, he was washy.
Yadda, yadda, yadda....
The NEA’s press release reports that the union will endeavor "to provide students, education employees and the general public with accurate, objective and up-to-date information regarding the needs of, and problems confronting gay, lesbian, bisexual and transgendered students."
As if we should care about these problems.
Dennis,
You must be kidding ? That can't be right, Muslims overwhelmingly dislike Americans or their policy? NO, say it aint so Dennis, damn, there go the family vaction plans to Pakistan. We thought maybe we would go and try to interview some of those poor oprressed but rich middle class terrorists. I sure hope they don't kdnap, torture and slit our throats because of our religion or country.
He does here ! but damn, There goes the Iranian vote.
YEP, BIG TIME.
Yes and many of the lies and propaganda coming from Superior WI.
No Dennis,
THEY dug the hole. It's where the f---ing world trade center used to be. But you're right. Let's negotiate and try to be reasonable with people like this, maybe if we just sit down and have a coke with them and try to listen to their side they will listen to us and they can tell us why they are mad. That's what Daniel Pearl tried to do and it got him tortured and murdered because he was American and Jewish. They are nothing but evil and murderous, no matter the reason. You fail to see that sometimes people are just evil and wrong but instead try to blame it on the U.S. You are an apologist for pure evil. Right I know Dennis, you think their acts were horrible, right o.k we got it. But of course everytime we turn around instead of telling us how wrong they are and how evil they are you look for a reason to blame us even more or find reason in their insanity. They are evil plain and simple. But keep looking at it from their point of view I'm sure people apologized or reasoned that the Nazi's were opresssed as well.
Daschle: what a joke!
Yes Dennis it's a good thing you are worried what muslims think of America seeing what great and reasonable folks these people seem to be.
A.P Wed Feb 27th 2002
A Muslim mob set fire to a train carrying Hindu nationalists home from a disputed religious site today, killing at least 57 people, officials said. Fearing religious strife could spread, the prime minister appealed for calm.
The fire gutted four coaches in the early morning attack at a station in the western city of Godhra, where Muslims angered by slogans chanted by the Hindus stoned the train cars and doused them with kerosene, according to state officials and witnesses.
Fourteen children were among the dead
http://www.twincities.com/mld/pioneerpress/2757412.htm
See Dennis, just like the U.S they invited attack because they angered the muslim mob. They were chanting slogans I wonder what the muslims attitude in the polls was towards the hindu's ? If only the hindu's tried to listen and respect thier feelings it wouldn't happen. It must have been thier fault. Poor opressed mob.
Well, that certainly helped matters.
Shall we now mount up for an anti-Islamic global pogrom?
It is the stubborn unwillingness -- no, the myth-believing, prejudice-saturated inability -- of that class of Americans who wield power and shape policy, always in the selfish interest of economic elites to which they themselves are profitably tied, to see that the United States is inflicting a massive, international injustice and an infuriating affront on particularly Third World humanity...that GUARANTEES that we will only grow more hated by more people around the planet as our haughty hegemonism spreads.
Poisonously.
Perniciously.
Perhaps you saw the piece on the evening news last night how anti-Americanism is rapidly growing in Afghanistan.
People there are seeing that America has an agenda wholly different than that which Washington has piously professed, and which works at ultimately vicious cross purposes with legitimate Afghani aspirations.
Vietstan, shaping up.
And not just there, but everywhere we think we know what's best, and that the imposition of our "model" is what the locals need.
Dennis:
I don't know, and you don't know the level of like or dislike of Americans in Afghanistan. But what if the American contingency along with the newly formed government decided today that a vast mistake has been made; and they have decided to turn the government back over to the Taliban? Do you think the Afghan people would be happier with that?
You talk about being "prejudice saturated." From what I recall of the two videotapes from Osama bin Laden and from his statements in the past, he practices religious prejudice to the extreme. Americans are infidels and the US preesence in Saudi Arabia is an affront to Islam. You talk about your bigotry? -- there it is, writ large. The Madrassas in Pakistan instill intense religious hatred for non-Muslims.
I defy you to say there is anything comperable in the United States.
Oh, but the US is arrogant. That and prosperous.
You don't need to look as far to find an "infuriating affront." They're still cleaning one up in New York. And it's not mythical.
Why should we care about anti-Americanism in Afghanistan when we have plenty right here? See almost any Rahkonen post for confirmation.
Jethro, what's so funny about this story you posted the other day?
http://www.twincities.com/mld/pioneerpress/2750103.htm
Why do you want to know?
I didn't understand your reaction to the story. I thought maybe I was missing something.
Because you posted the article and laughed, and when queried about it, laughed again. Now you've been queried again and you're being coy. If you're not interested in answering, say so. I'm not curious enough to follow up any more.
So you didn't understand it either, Muskwa?
HAHAHAHAHAHAHA........
All righty then.
Jethro's officially gone off the deep end.
Jethro's officially gone off the deep end.
At last it's professional sanctioned insanity. We'll be expecting a much higher level of crazy from now on Jethro.
Bob Byrd's senility is showing.
Rick,
good post on #411. Nice job.
Dennis,
Oh, sorry Dennis, I wouldn't want to offend the people who killed 57 Hindu's because they angered them. It's not anti Islamic, it's anti murderous thug. It's anti evil. I don't care what religious persuasion someone is as long as they aren't killing people in the name of that religion. It doesn't make all muslims bad. It makes the murderous thugs who would do deeds like that and 9-11 that need to be dealt with. If they are willing to do that to us and 57 Hindu's because they didn't like them you can't negoitiate with these people. They are evil. Something you seem quite prepared to continuously apologize for.
Dennis, This b.s myth you perpatrate about the terrorists being poor opressed people is a joke. Most of them were middle to upper middle class people who had access to travel and studied abroad. I point out a story about 57 Hindu's killed by muslim extremists and instead of condemming that you continue to pile on. I am sure you do condemn it but used it as another anti U.S diatribe and cry in your oatmeal about big evil business interests. But not a WORD about the 57 Hindu's killed. And you are worried about Muslim approval ratings for the U.S in countries such as that ? Yes Dennis they hate us for different reasons. But hey let's negotiate with people willing to hate and kill Hindu's because they dislike or disagree with them. They give us or would give us and have given us the same treatment. Keep apologizing for evil Dennis, It's apologists like you who are blinded by your own dislike for your government. And fail to see or deny that some people are just evil.
No, and I'm beyond caring. Jethro's behaving like a child and I'm not going to encourage him anymore.
So are you saying that you are taking your ball and going home, Muskwa?
Let's put it in the simplest terms...
We were struck on 9/11 because we're deeply hated by much of the world.
The United States was the target, not Switzerland or Canada, or any other country.
That targeted enmity stems from an nderstandably profound resentment toward self-serving "Yankee" foreign policy -- a historically unequaled imperialism that takes, never gives, is perpetually demanding, and forecloses all possibilities for independent, native choice or development.
It's either have the sharp-edged American paradigm shoved down your throats...or watch out for the Marines, the CIA, the b-52's, and the cruise missiles!
Changing this abysmal, intolerable arrogance would not be "appeasing" an enemy.
It would constitute doing the objectively and universally right thing -- and winning sufficient friends for America that terrorists would have no
basis for popular appeal.
We absolutely need to admit our prior, pivotal role in inflaming the sensibilities of peoples around the planet who have their own, valid
values and traditions, and who don't want anything to do with Britney Spears or Joe Camel.
We must curb our outrageously offensive economic/ideological/political/cultural Coca-colonization of humankind.
If we don't, we'll be attacked, again and again and again.
We can't win without being right (nor should we expect to), and the everyday, negative impact of our global behavior on multitudinous millions
across the planet is THE worst WRONG of our time.
It's not for nothing that we're seen as the Great Satan on such a huge scale.
The Third World's human and natural wealth -- its lifeblood -- fuels Western prosperity, and nations with proud links to rich civilations and glorious traditions are being forced to become
Junior America's, with degrading imposition of all of our own decaying society's attitudes and assumptions.
No, the terrorist aren't right.
But, at levels two or three tiers below, where
mass consciousness boils, we are justly and properly condemned for our greed and meddling.
Please try to look past Old Glory binding your
eyes.
See what we're doing, and how our own country's safety and very viability will be grievously undercut if remedial change isn'timplemented.
Let's put it in the simplest terms...
We were struck on 9/11 because we're deeply hated by much of the world.
The United States was the target, not Switzerland or Canada, or any other country.
That targeted enmity stems from an nderstandably profound resentment toward self-serving "Yankee" foreign policy -- a historically unequaled imperialism that takes, never gives, is perpetually demanding, and forecloses all possibilities for independent, native choice or development.
It's either have the sharp-edged American paradigm shoved down your throats...or watch out for the Marines, the CIA, the b-52's, and the cruise missiles!
Changing this abysmal, intolerable arrogance would not be "appeasing" an enemy.
It would constitute doing the objectively and universally right thing -- and winning sufficient friends for America that terrorists would have no
basis for popular appeal.
We absolutely need to admit our prior, pivotal role in inflaming the sensibilities of peoples around the planet who have their own, valid
values and traditions, and who don't want anything to do with Britney Spears or Joe Camel.
We must curb our outrageously offensive economic/ideological/political/cultural Coca-colonization of humankind.
If we don't, we'll be attacked, again and again and again.
We can't win without being right (nor should we expect to), and the everyday, negative impact of our global behavior on multitudinous millions
across the planet is THE worst WRONG of our time.
It's not for nothing that we're seen as the Great Satan on such a huge scale.
The Third World's human and natural wealth -- its lifeblood -- fuels Western prosperity, and nations with proud links to rich civilations and glorious traditions are being forced to become
Junior America's, with degrading imposition of all of our own decaying society's attitudes and assumptions.
No, the terrorist aren't right.
But, at levels two or three tiers below, where
mass consciousness boils, we are justly and properly condemned for our greed and meddling.
Please try to look past Old Glory binding your
eyes.
See what we're doing, and how our own country's safety and very viability will be grievously undercut if remedial change isn't implemented.
Sorry about the double post and typos...
So, then Dennis:
The United States isn't populated by infidels?
This isn't a holy war?
Danny Pearl wasn't killed because he was a Jew?
It's about Britney Spears and Joe Camel? They're commodities, which means purchase is a choice. No one has to buy if they're so offensive.
Dennis,
Never gives ? We have no foreign aid ? Send no peace corp workers ? Is it always self serving ? To you maybe it is. So we never help any one other than us ? we never do anything because it's the right thing to do?
>Changing this abysmal, intolerable arrogance would not be "appeasing" an enemy.
It would constitute doing the objectively and universally right thing -- and winning sufficient friends for America that terrorists would have no
basis for popular appeal.
Terrorists have popular appeal now ?
so what should we do. Pull out of every country ?become isolationist again ? (we tried that once rremember)Send a check and say here you go, we won't ask anything or expect anything in return. What is your suggestion. It's easy to criticize but i would be interested to hear your solution.
The worst wrong of our time ? Really Dennis, You don't think ohhh the massacres in Rawanda or genocide in the Balkans might just be up there ?
Many of the terrorists were from Saudi Arabia. We were invited there, they sell their oil voulintarily. Many of the companies that do business around the globe do so because people in those countries buy thier products. Many of those companies provide jobs that otherwise would not be there. Are they all without sin or abuse, no way. But what you fail to see is that many many in these countries aspire to have what we have been blessed with. as much as it pains you, the truth is that democracy and capatalism is the foundation of why we are where we are today. I know spare me the evil corporate anti capatalist rant. the truth is that capatalism has allowed us to flourish. No other country has rivaled in history the prosperity we have for all it's imperfections we are the most prosperous nation on earth. Some simply resent that. But why is it that many come from these other countries risking their lives in many cases to do so. So what will make these other nations prosperous ? tyranical communist, socailist, facist, fanatacist rule ? closed government? no freedom? How do these nations become more viable ? the systems they have had over the last 500 years haven't done it. What's wrong with supporting that?
Look. It would be one thing if we could negotiate, reason or even have dialouge with these people. China is willing to listen and adress human rights abuses through economic and diplomatic pressure and visa versa. But Dennis, we arent dealing with a formal government or sane rationale people we can have dialouge with. It's brought about by fanatical extremists who wish to rule the world as they see it. It comes down to who's right or who's wrong / Who's more evil, who's less evil? I think we know which side you think that is.
Kudos again Rick on the above.
Smart thinkin' Muskwa.
I should try that once.
Dennis, Double posts happen from time to time and as for the typos ? Don't ever apologize to anyone on this bored fort the typin airors. Thaks spel czech
You a pilot by profession or just a hobby?
Just a hobby THX, I am working right now to finish my private lisc and want to get my I.F.R rating. I wish it was for a living that's my dream job. Actually it's been a passion since I was a kid. My Gandfather was a B-17 pilot in WW2 and flew professionally it got me interested in it. I love it, hence the name. Unfortunatley it's not a cheap hobby so I get some hours in trade and have to save up in between to get hours in. It's a blast.