When Gary told me he had found Jesus, I thought, Ya-hoo! We're rich! But it turned out to be something different.
ThoseMedallingKids
Don't you see a difference between private behavior and public records?
Heterosexuals can get married. Privately they practice sex together, but they are able to marry publicly. Also, isn't the birth of a child (plus birth certificate) something that comes from a private behavior?
Don't you see a difference between private behavior and public records?
Heterosexuals can get married. Privately they practice sex together, but they are able to marry publicly. Also, isn't the birth of a child (plus birth certificate) something that comes from a private behavior?
what is your point? My position is that society can recognize and promote and give benefits to those people that behave in accordance with society's morals.
The fact is society has a legitimate interest in regulating behavior. If this is one that society wants to allow they can. - bodine
I have always said that what people do behind closed doors is their business - bodine
crabs: one of these things is not like the other
These address two different things. One, what society has the right to do and one is my opinion.
isn't what people do behind closed doors, quite possibly behavior that you belive society should take an interest in regulating? so no, they don't address two different things.
isn't what people do behind closed doors, quite possibly behavior that you belive society should take an interest in regulating? so no, they don't address two different things.
Yes they are two different things. One is my personal opinion the other is society's power and its collective opinion. If society wants to regualte behavior of people behind closed doors they should be able to do that. In fact, that is what Texas did until the supreme court struck its sodomy law. Whether I agree with the collective opinion of what society does is a differnt matter. Get it now?
My position is that society can recognize and promote and give benefits to those people that behave in accordance with society's morals.
that behave in ways that are none of your business.
It is society's business when people come looking for society's approval and acceptance.
why isn't it your business how they behave, but you want it to be society's business?
Because society has the right to regulate behavior it finds offensive. I may or may not disagree with what is offensive but if there is enough people that disagree then I have to live with it until society's opinion is changed.
If society wants to regulate behavior of people behind closed doors they should be able to do that.
so, you aren't part of society? you can't have it both ways.
Since they are two different things then "having it both ways" doesn't apply
you can't say it's none of your business unless enough of you want to make it their business and then it's okay.
Yes I can. And it is quite consistent to thinking people.
CBS News recently asked: "Would you favor or oppose an amendment to the U.S. Constitution that would allow marriage ONLY between a man and a woman?" In December, the American public split 55 percent to 40 percent in favor. By last week, 59 percent of Americans favored an federal marriage amendment, and just 35 percent opposed it.
The more Americans hear about same-sex marriage, the less they like it.
And it's not just Republicans or conservatives: 55 percent of Democrats support a constitutional amendment defining marriage.
SAN FRANCISCO — The California Supreme Court ordered an immediate halt to gay marriages in San Francisco and said Thursday it would hear a case in May or June on the legality of such marriages.
The majority of people use their heart -- stirred by their eyes -- to determine what is right and wrong. A minority uses their mind and/or the Bible to make that determination.
Pick almost any issue and these opposing ways of determining right and wrong become apparent.
ATLANTA — More than two dozen black pastors added their voice to the critics of same-sex marriage, attempting to distance the civil rights struggle from the gay rights movement and defending marriage as a union between a man and a woman.
Ask some non-religious liberal friends how they would describe a person who attended only fundamentalist Christian or ultra-Orthodox Jewish schools from preschool through graduate school. "Brainwashed" and "closed-minded" would be their most likely answers, and they would often be right. Most people assume that any person who is exposed to only one way of looking at the world for all of his or her life can hardly be regarded as open-minded.
....................
The majority of even fundamentalist Christians and Orthodox Jews are exposed to far more secular thought and behavior than the secular are exposed to religious thought and behavior. Virtually all religious Christians and Jews study secular subjects, have been taught by secular teachers, read secular books, and watch secular films and secular television.
About 3,000 Minnesotans flocked to the state Capitol on Monday to lend their support, prayers and votes to a constitutional amendment to proclaim that only the union of one man and one woman is marriage in this state.
The other day a lesbian Methodist pastor was acquitted on charges stemming from her sexual orientation and will continue in her ministry. A jury of pastors in Bothell, Wash., deliberated for 10 hours before a majority ruled that the homosexual relationship between Rev. Karen Dammann and another woman, who were recently "married," is allowable under the church's social principles, even though the Methodist Book of Discipline declares homosexual practice to be "incompatible to Christian teachings."
Then comes the real shock. Among these Jews there suddenly turns up a man who goes about talking as if He was God. He claims to forgive sins. He says He has always existed. He says He is coming to judge the world at the end of time. I am trying here to prevent anyone saying the really foolish thing that people often say about Him: "I'm ready to accept Jesus as a great moral teacher, but I don't accept His claim to be God," This is the one things we must not say.
A man who was merely a man and. said the sort of things Jesus said would not be a great moral teacher. He would either be a lunatic... or else he would be the Devil of Hell. You must make your choice. Either this man was, and is, the Son of God: or else a madman or something worse. You can shut Him up for a fool; you can spit at Him and kill Him as a demon; or you can fall at His feet and call Him Lord and God. But let us not come with any patronizing nonsense about His being a great human teacher. He has not left that open to us. He did not intend to.
(From C.S. Lewis, MERE CHRISTIANITY, Barbour and Company inc., pp.44,45)
"Either this man was, and is, the Son of God: or else a madman or something worse."
I remember in college hearing this from Christian groups. I found it off-putting and coercive.
If someone is on a sincere search for spirituality, why say, in essence, my way or the highway. Framing their case like that either brings people to their side out of stark fear, or pushes them away. But nothing in between.
If someone is on a sincere search for spirituality, why say, in essence, my way or the highway. Framing their case like that either brings people to their side out of stark fear, or pushes them away. But nothing in between.
So you don't see anything strange about someone speaking of themselves as if he or she was God or claims to forgive sins or says that he has always existed or says that he is coming to judge the world at the end of time? You would just accept that they were what they say they are?
I don't understand your questions. I'm not speaking about myself, only C.S. Lewis' statement and how it was ham-fistedly co-opted by guys I knew in college.
I don't know how people can be led to Christianity through confrontation.
Rick, I am God. I can forgive your sins if you will confess and repent them. I have existed throughout time and will judge you and the world at the end of time. Follow me and you will have everlasting life.*
Beside, where in the bible does it say that you must stone your children? - Dan Zachary
"Suppose a man has a stubborn, rebellious son who will not obey his father or mother, even though they discipline him. In such cases, the father and mother must take the son before the leaders of the town. They must declare: 'This son of ours is stubborn and rebellious and refuses to obey. He is a worthless drunkard.' Then all the men of the town must stone him to death. In this way, you will cleanse this evil from among you, and all Israel will hear about it and be afraid." - Deuteronomy 21:18-21
"If a man commits adultery with another man's wife, both the man and the woman must be put to death." - Leviticus 20:10
I don't recall you Bible believers calling for Nancy Reagan's astrologer to be stoned to death...why is that?
"A man or a woman who acts as a medium or fortuneteller shall be put to death by stoning; they have no one but themselves to blame for their death." - Leviticus 20:27
and to compound matters, she used the astrologer's advice to tell her husband what to do....
"Women should listen and learn quietly and submissively. I do not let women teach men or have authority over them. Let them listen quietly. For God made Adam first, and afterward he made Eve. And it was the woman, not Adam, who was deceived by Satan, and sin was the result. But women will be saved through childbearing and by continuing to live in faith, love, holiness, and modesty." - 1 Timothy 2:11-15
"As in all the churches of the holy ones, women should keep silent in the churches, for they are not allowed to speak, but should be subordinate, as even the law says. But if they want to learn anything, they should ask their husbands at home. For it is improper for a woman to speak in the church." - 1 Corinthians 14:33-35
and while I like Jesus for his teachings of pacifism, I cannot in good conscience be a disciple of his since I like my parents too much....
" [Jesus speaking] If anyone comes to me without hating his father and mother, wife and children, brothers and sisters, and even his own life, he can not be my disciple." - Luke 14:26
and if you believe the Book, eat shit...
Each day prepare your bread as you would barley cakes. While all the people are watching, bake it over a fire using dried human dung as fuel and then eat the bread. For this is what the LORD says: Israel will eat defiled bread in the Gentile lands, where I will banish them!" Then I said, "O Sovereign LORD, must I be defiled by using human dung? For I have never been defiled before. From the time I was a child until now I have never eaten any animal that died of sickness or that I found dead. And I have never eaten any of the animals that our laws forbid." "All right," the LORD said. "You may bake your bread with cow dung instead of human dung." - Ezekiel 4:12-15
It would seem that this is an adult son and not a child. Note that they say he is a drunkard among other things. Also note that he is given many chances to repent and change his ways. I would assume that the elders could give a punishment that fits the crime committed much like we have varying punishments in our system of justice. All it says is that he is stubborn and rebellious. I do not believe that they would stone him for the crime of, for example, not cleaning his plate of food when asked to.
Leviticus 20:10
Yes, such sin was taken very seriously in the old testament. It also list a lot of other forms. Fathers wife, daughter in law, daughter and mother, etc. Notice 13) "If a man also lie with mankind, as he lieth with a woman, both of them have committed an abomination". This is the only one that is called an "abomination". In the new testament, Jesus was sacrificed for such sins. This does not give us freedom to commit such acts, but rather the chance to seek forgiveness from them.
Leviticus 20:27
See the above about Jesus. Yes, Nancy was wrong in what she did.
1 Timothy 2:11-15, 1 Corinthians 14:33-35
Man was made in the image of God. Woman was made in the image of man. This does not mean that the woman is a man's slave, for the bible also tells us that they become one when married. A man should treat his wife with great respect because she and he are one.
While there is a hierarchical relationship, men and women need each other. There is, however, different roles given to men and women. Again, this is not to say that man is better than women, just different.
As for Nancy, I already said that what she did was wrong. To try to lead her husband down the same path only compounded the problem.
Luke 14:26
Jesus was not saying that we should hold a bitter feeling towards our relatives. What he was saying is that he should come first. There should be no earthly tie to seperate us from him. If our parents are against our seeking him, we should love our parents, but respectfully tell them that we must seek Christ first. In this case it comes down to do I love God more, or do I love my parents more?
Ezekiel 4:12-15
The dung was used for fuel for the fire, not as an ingredient. Your comment was uncalled for and very mean spirited.
I am sure that times were tough for them since they were attacking a city. It wasn't like they could go to the local grocer and get a bag of charcoal.
Also note that he is given many chances to repent and change his ways. I would assume that the elders could give a punishment that fits the crime committed much like we have varying punishments in our system of justice. All it says is that he is stubborn and rebellious.
the "crime" was not obeying his parents and the punishment is clearly spelled out...death by stoning.
I do not believe that they would stone him for the crime of, for example, not cleaning his plate of food when asked to.
what DO you think they would stone him to death for?
There is, however, different roles given to men and women.
do they let women speak in your church? because that's forbidden according to your book.
those "roles" you speak of are master and subservient.
Jesus was not saying that we should hold a bitter feeling towards our relatives. What he was saying is that he should come first.
no...he very specifically says...
If anyone comes to me without hating his father and mother, wife and children, brothers and sisters, and even his own life, he can not be my disciple.
he doesn't say "you should love them less than me...he says you should hate them.
There should be no earthly tie to seperate us from him. If our parents are against our seeking him, we should love our parents, but respectfully tell them that we must seek Christ first. In this case it comes down to do I love God more, or do I love my parents more?
he says we should hate them, which creates a catch-22, because that would be disrespectful and get you stoned to death.
and besides. what sort of god is this that forces you to love him more than your own parents?
The dung was used for fuel for the fire, not as an ingredient. Your comment was uncalled for and very mean spirited.
it was your book that said you should cook with dung.
now...wanna talk about circumcision? because the Bible sure wants you to cut that foreskin. Before Moses' wife did it to their kid, God was really pissed off, wanted to kill him even.
has it never occured to you that the Bible may have actually been written by mortal men with an agenda?
and whatever you do, ladies...if you husband is betting beat up, don't grab the other guy's balls...
"If two Israelite men are fighting and the wife of one tries to rescue her husband by grabbing the testicles of the other man, her hand must be cut off without pity." - Deuteronomy 25:11-12 Â Â
and by the way, don't marry a foriegner or you get beaten up...
"About the same time I realized that some of the men of Judah had married women from Ashdod, Ammon, and Moab. Even worse, half their children spoke in the language of Ashdod or some other people and could not speak the language of Judah at all. So I confronted them and called down curses on them. I beat some of them and pulled out their hair. I made them swear before God that they would not let their children intermarry with the pagan people of the land. 'Wasn't this exactly what led King Solomon of Israel into sin?' I demanded. 'There was no king from any nation who could compare to him, and God loved him and made him king over all Israel. But even he was led into sin by his foreign wives. How could you even think of committing this sinful deed and acting unfaithfully toward God by marrying foreign women?'" - Nehemiah 13:23-27
homosexual marriage? forget that, you should just kill them...
"If a man lies with a male as with a women, both of them shall be put to death for their abominable deed; they have forfeited their lives." - Leviticus 20:13
it's okay to beat your slave, just not too hard...
"When a man strikes his male or female slave with a rod so hard that the slave dies under his hand, he shall be punished. If, however, the slave survives for a day or two, he is not to be punished, since the slave is his own property." - Exodus 21:20-21
and heaven forbid your dad or granddad or even great-granddad was a sculpter....
"You shall not carve idols for yourselves in the shape of anything in the sky above or on the earth below or in the waters beneath the earth; you shall not bow down before them or worship them. For I, the Lord, your God, am a jealous God, inflicting punishment for their father's wickedness on the children of those who hate me, down to the third and fourth generation" - Exodus 20:4-5
and if dad puts a fish on his car, does that mean that God will punish the kids?
that green-eyed God sure is a meany...I mean, those innocent kids can't help if their parents are artistic.
what sort of God is this that take out his jealous rage toward someone on innocent great-grandchildren?
and if that one doesn't convince you that God kills children for the sins of their parents, here's another one...
"Make ready to slaughter his sons for the guilt of their fathers; Lest they rise and possess the earth, and fill the breadth of the world with tyrants." - Isaiah 14:21
I will not expose my family to someone who is as ignorant, mean spirited, bigoted, and full of hate as yourself.
I don't hate anyone. You would be surprised.
now God...some of that book of His is pretty mean spirited.
you wanna talk about bigoted and mean spirited, read some of that book you say you believe in....I mean, it gives instructions for how to treat slaves...it says to kill homosexuals.
In Florida, an atheist became incensed over the preparation for Easter and Passover holidays and decided to contact the local ACLU about the discrimination inflicted on atheists by the constant celebrations afforded to Christians and Jews with all their holidays while the atheists had no holiday to celebrate.
The ACLU jumped on the opportunity to once again pick up the cause of the godless and assigned their sharpest attorneys to the case.
The case was brought before a wise judge who after listening to the long, passionate presentation of the ACLU lawyers, promptly banged his gavel and declared, "Case dismissed!"
The lead ACLU lawyer immediately stood and objected to the ruling and said, "Your honor, how can you possibly dismiss this case? Surely the Christians have Christmas, Easter and many other observances. And the Jews--why in addition to Passover they have Yom Kippur and Hanukkah ...and yet my client and all other atheists have no such holiday!"
The judge leaned forward in his chair and simply said "Obviously your client is too confused to know about, or for that matter, even celebrate the atheists' holiday!"
The ACLU lawyer pompously said "We are aware of no such holiday for atheists, just when might that be, your honor?"
The judge said "Well it comes every year on exactly the same date---April 1st!"
Don't you see a difference between private behavior and public records?
Heterosexuals can get married. Privately they practice sex together, but they are able to marry publicly. Also, isn't the birth of a child (plus birth certificate) something that comes from a private behavior?
and when you change the phyical traits that define your sexuality, what does that do?
Nothing. You're simply changing physical traits.
I understand that bodine doesn't think that there are any physical traits that define sexuality, but do you?
I don't quite understand what you mean?
The fact is society has a legitimate interest in regulating behavior. If this is one that society wants to allow they can. - bodine
I have always said that what people do behind closed doors is their business - bodine
crabs: one of these things is not like the other
These address two different things. One, what society has the right to do and one is my opinion.
of course bodine doesn't think there are such things as homosexuals or hetrosexuals.
I see people not sexual behaviors. You should try it sometime, crabs.
Don't you see a difference between private behavior and public records?
Heterosexuals can get married. Privately they practice sex together, but they are able to marry publicly. Also, isn't the birth of a child (plus birth certificate) something that comes from a private behavior?
what is your point? My position is that society can recognize and promote and give benefits to those people that behave in accordance with society's morals.
The fact is society has a legitimate interest in regulating behavior. If this is one that society wants to allow they can. - bodine
I have always said that what people do behind closed doors is their business - bodine
crabs: one of these things is not like the other
These address two different things. One, what society has the right to do and one is my opinion.
isn't what people do behind closed doors, quite possibly behavior that you belive society should take an interest in regulating? so no, they don't address two different things.
isn't what people do behind closed doors, quite possibly behavior that you belive society should take an interest in regulating? so no, they don't address two different things.
Yes they are two different things. One is my personal opinion the other is society's power and its collective opinion. If society wants to regualte behavior of people behind closed doors they should be able to do that. In fact, that is what Texas did until the supreme court struck its sodomy law. Whether I agree with the collective opinion of what society does is a differnt matter. Get it now?
that behave in ways that are none of your business.
aren't you part of society, bodine?
why isn't it your business how they behave, but you want it to be society's business?
so, you aren't part of society?
you can't have it both ways.
you can't say it's none of your business unless enough of you want to make it their business and then it's okay.
that behave in ways that are none of your business.
It is society's business when people come looking for society's approval and acceptance.
why isn't it your business how they behave, but you want it to be society's business?
Because society has the right to regulate behavior it finds offensive. I may or may not disagree with what is offensive but if there is enough people that disagree then I have to live with it until society's opinion is changed.
If society wants to regulate behavior of people behind closed doors they should be able to do that.
so, you aren't part of society? you can't have it both ways.
Since they are two different things then "having it both ways" doesn't apply
you can't say it's none of your business unless enough of you want to make it their business and then it's okay.
Yes I can. And it is quite consistent to thinking people.
I disagree.
If society wants to regulate behavior of people behind closed doors they should be able to do that.
crabs: I disagree.
You can disagree but society has that power.
so did the Nazis
CBS News recently asked: "Would you favor or oppose an amendment to the U.S. Constitution that would allow marriage ONLY between a man and a woman?" In December, the American public split 55 percent to 40 percent in favor. By last week, 59 percent of Americans favored an federal marriage amendment, and just 35 percent opposed it.
The more Americans hear about same-sex marriage, the less they like it.
And it's not just Republicans or conservatives: 55 percent of Democrats support a constitutional amendment defining marriage.
http://www.townhall.com/columnists/maggiegallagher/mg20040303.shtml
SAN FRANCISCO — The California Supreme Court ordered an immediate halt to gay marriages in San Francisco and said Thursday it would hear a case in May or June on the legality of such marriages.
http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,113995,00.html
The majority of people use their heart -- stirred by their eyes -- to determine what is right and wrong. A minority uses their mind and/or the Bible to make that determination.
Pick almost any issue and these opposing ways of determining right and wrong become apparent.
Here are three examples.
http://www.townhall.com/columnists/dennisprager/dp20040316.shtml
Many advocates of same-sex marriage recognize that it is part of a strategy of deconstructing any social ideal in family or sexual life.
http://www.townhall.com/columnists/maggiegallagher/mg20040316.shtml
It's about getting their hands on taxpayer money.
Ventura speaks in favor of gay marriage
http://www.kstp.com/article/view/133333/
ATLANTA — More than two dozen black pastors added their voice to the critics of same-sex marriage, attempting to distance the civil rights struggle from the gay rights movement and defending marriage as a union between a man and a woman.
http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,114936,00.html
Ventura speaks in favor of gay marriage
Jesse sure looks different with hair and a beard.
Ask some non-religious liberal friends how they would describe a person who attended only fundamentalist Christian or ultra-Orthodox Jewish schools from preschool through graduate school. "Brainwashed" and "closed-minded" would be their most likely answers, and they would often be right. Most people assume that any person who is exposed to only one way of looking at the world for all of his or her life can hardly be regarded as open-minded.
....................
The majority of even fundamentalist Christians and Orthodox Jews are exposed to far more secular thought and behavior than the secular are exposed to religious thought and behavior. Virtually all religious Christians and Jews study secular subjects, have been taught by secular teachers, read secular books, and watch secular films and secular television.
http://www.townhall.com/columnists/dennisprager/dp20040323.shtml
Thousands rally for gay marriage ban
About 3,000 Minnesotans flocked to the state Capitol on Monday to lend their support, prayers and votes to a constitutional amendment to proclaim that only the union of one man and one woman is marriage in this state.
http://www.twincities.com/mld/twincities/news/local/8251943.htm
The other day a lesbian Methodist pastor was acquitted on charges stemming from her sexual orientation and will continue in her ministry. A jury of pastors in Bothell, Wash., deliberated for 10 hours before a majority ruled that the homosexual relationship between Rev. Karen Dammann and another woman, who were recently "married," is allowable under the church's social principles, even though the Methodist Book of Discipline declares homosexual practice to be "incompatible to Christian teachings."
http://www.townhall.com/columnists/calthomas/ct20040329.shtml
Then comes the real shock. Among these Jews there suddenly turns up a man who goes about talking as if He was God. He claims to forgive sins. He says He has always existed. He says He is coming to judge the world at the end of time.
I am trying here to prevent anyone saying the really foolish thing that people often say about Him: "I'm ready to accept Jesus as a great moral teacher, but I don't accept His claim to be God," This is the one things we must not say.
A man who was merely a man and. said the sort of things Jesus said would not be a great moral teacher. He would either be a lunatic... or else he would be the Devil of Hell. You must make your choice. Either this man was, and is, the Son of God: or else a madman or something worse. You can shut Him up for a fool; you can spit at Him and kill Him as a demon; or you can fall at His feet and call Him Lord and God. But let us not come with any patronizing nonsense about His being a great human teacher. He has not left that open to us. He did not intend to.
(From C.S. Lewis, MERE CHRISTIANITY, Barbour and Company inc., pp.44,45)
"Either this man was, and is, the Son of God: or else a madman or something worse."
I remember in college hearing this from Christian groups. I found it off-putting and coercive.
If someone is on a sincere search for spirituality, why say, in essence, my way or the highway. Framing their case like that either brings people to their side out of stark fear, or pushes them away. But nothing in between.
If someone is on a sincere search for spirituality, why say, in essence, my way or the highway. Framing their case like that either brings people to their side out of stark fear, or pushes them away. But nothing in between.
So you don't see anything strange about someone speaking of themselves as if he or she was God or claims to forgive sins or says that he has always existed or says that he is coming to judge the world at the end of time? You would just accept that they were what they say they are?
I don't understand your questions. I'm not speaking about myself, only C.S. Lewis' statement and how it was ham-fistedly co-opted by guys I knew in college.
I don't know how people can be led to Christianity through confrontation.
You don't understand the questions but you understand what C.S. Lewis was saying?
That's right.
Rick, I am God. I can forgive your sins if you will confess and repent them. I have existed throughout time and will judge you and the world at the end of time. Follow me and you will have everlasting life.*
Beside, where in the bible does it say that you must stone your children? - Dan Zachary
I don't recall you Bible believers calling for Nancy Reagan's astrologer to be stoned to death...why is that?
and to compound matters, she used the astrologer's advice to tell her husband what to do....
and while I like Jesus for his teachings of pacifism, I cannot in good conscience be a disciple of his since I like my parents too much....
and if you believe the Book, eat shit...
Deuteronomy 21:18-21
It would seem that this is an adult son and not a child. Note that they say he is a drunkard among other things. Also note that he is given many chances to repent and change his ways. I would assume that the elders could give a punishment that fits the crime committed much like we have varying punishments in our system of justice. All it says is that he is stubborn and rebellious. I do not believe that they would stone him for the crime of, for example, not cleaning his plate of food when asked to.
Leviticus 20:10
Yes, such sin was taken very seriously in the old testament. It also list a lot of other forms. Fathers wife, daughter in law, daughter and mother, etc. Notice 13) "If a man also lie with mankind, as he lieth with a woman, both of them have committed an abomination". This is the only one that is called an "abomination". In the new testament, Jesus was sacrificed for such sins. This does not give us freedom to commit such acts, but rather the chance to seek forgiveness from them.
Leviticus 20:27
See the above about Jesus. Yes, Nancy was wrong in what she did.
1 Timothy 2:11-15, 1 Corinthians 14:33-35
Man was made in the image of God. Woman was made in the image of man. This does not mean that the woman is a man's slave, for the bible also tells us that they become one when married. A man should treat his wife with great respect because she and he are one.
While there is a hierarchical relationship, men and women need each other. There is, however, different roles given to men and women. Again, this is not to say that man is better than women, just different.
As for Nancy, I already said that what she did was wrong. To try to lead her husband down the same path only compounded the problem.
Luke 14:26
Jesus was not saying that we should hold a bitter feeling towards our relatives. What he was saying is that he should come first. There should be no earthly tie to seperate us from him. If our parents are against our seeking him, we should love our parents, but respectfully tell them that we must seek Christ first. In this case it comes down to do I love God more, or do I love my parents more?
Ezekiel 4:12-15
The dung was used for fuel for the fire, not as an ingredient. Your comment was uncalled for and very mean spirited.
I am sure that times were tough for them since they were attacking a city. It wasn't like they could go to the local grocer and get a bag of charcoal.
so, you want we should stone her to death? It would serve her right according to your book.
the "crime" was not obeying his parents and the punishment is clearly spelled out...death by stoning.
what DO you think they would stone him to death for?
do they let women speak in your church? because that's forbidden according to your book.
those "roles" you speak of are master and subservient.
no...he very specifically says...
he doesn't say "you should love them less than me...he says you should hate them.
he says we should hate them, which creates a catch-22, because that would be disrespectful and get you stoned to death.
and besides. what sort of god is this that forces you to love him more than your own parents?
it was your book that said you should cook with dung.
now...wanna talk about circumcision? because the Bible sure wants you to cut that foreskin. Before Moses' wife did it to their kid, God was really pissed off, wanted to kill him even.
has it never occured to you that the Bible may have actually been written by mortal men with an agenda?
and whatever you do, ladies...if you husband is betting beat up, don't grab the other guy's balls...
and by the way, don't marry a foriegner or you get beaten up...
homosexual marriage? forget that, you should just kill them...
it's okay to beat your slave, just not too hard...
and heaven forbid your dad or granddad or even great-granddad was a sculpter....
and if dad puts a fish on his car, does that mean that God will punish the kids?
that green-eyed God sure is a meany...I mean, those innocent kids can't help if their parents are artistic.
what sort of God is this that take out his jealous rage toward someone on innocent great-grandchildren?
and if that one doesn't convince you that God kills children for the sins of their parents, here's another one...
makes note to self to turn down any invitation to one of Dan's bar-b-que.
Don't worry about that Crabs. I will not expose my family to someone who is as ignorant, mean spirited, bigoted, and full of hate as yourself.
I don't hate anyone. You would be surprised.
now God...some of that book of His is pretty mean spirited.
you wanna talk about bigoted and mean spirited, read some of that book you say you believe in....I mean, it gives instructions for how to treat slaves...it says to kill homosexuals.
so, tell me Dan, do you really believe in all those things from the Bible?
are you saying that parts of the word of God are bad?
so, you are supposed to just believe the parts of it that you think are good?
I've already said I like a lot of what Jesus taught, but it seems at odds with a lot of what his Dad said.
Yeah, that's it.
Ditto
We sure think alike.
A little humor:
In Florida, an atheist became incensed over the preparation for Easter and Passover holidays and decided to contact the local ACLU about the discrimination inflicted on atheists by the constant celebrations afforded to Christians and Jews with all their holidays while the atheists had no holiday to celebrate.
The ACLU jumped on the opportunity to once again pick up the cause of the godless and assigned their sharpest attorneys to the case.
The case was brought before a wise judge who after listening to the long, passionate presentation of the ACLU lawyers, promptly banged his gavel and declared, "Case dismissed!"
The lead ACLU lawyer immediately stood and objected to the ruling and said, "Your honor, how can you possibly dismiss this case? Surely the Christians have Christmas, Easter and many other observances. And the Jews--why in addition to Passover they have Yom Kippur and Hanukkah ...and yet my client and all other atheists have no such holiday!"
The judge leaned forward in his chair and simply said "Obviously your client is too confused to know about, or for that matter, even celebrate the atheists' holiday!"
The ACLU lawyer pompously said "We are aware of no such holiday for atheists, just when might that be, your honor?"
The judge said "Well it comes every year on exactly the same date---April 1st!"