The land that Bruce Vento Trail runs through on the east side of the lake is owned by the Ramsey County Railroad & Housing Authority. Not sure if that technically makes it public. It also looks like the wooded area South of Shore drive and East of Johnson is part of the park. My first find on "coal man" was Clarence W Wigington who was an award winning artist with Charcoal...The pavilion on Harriet Island IS named after him, however he grew up in Omaha, Nebraska (his path) and Nebraska Ave leads to the east side of Phalen Lake. It actually turns north and becomes Atlantic Ave (a grand body of water). Also Clarence street is just east of McAfee street (virus protection from hackers) which is just east of BV Trail. South of there you'd be careful not to traipse on Ivy (flora). One of the old maps from the site David shared showed "WATER TANK" on the north east side of the lake. It sure does feel like we're being directed to the South and East side of the lake, and I agree with David that if the BV trail is in play, they would be using Phalen clues to get us there. So what do people think? Is the Trail over there in play or do we have to keep ourselves in the park property? The plot of land south of maryland on either side of Johnson is also part of the park...There are some tennis courts you might swing on down to.
My Phalen thought on this clue is that it does refer to James J. Hill. He was in fact a coal guy who moved to St. Paul and then started up a railroad, the Great Northern. His path would have been the railways (though I think that is also a hint to a current day path). Math is neither good nor bad, so I'm thinking in this case good math means "profitable", which his railroad was. He at one point tried to buy the Northern Pacific railroad but then had to give it up because of anti-trust laws, though he still mostly controlled it. So in that sense, the Northern Pacific "fell short of Hill". But what once was the Northern Pacific railway is now the Bruce Vento Trail. Of course this answer could also apply to BVNS and Swede Hollow and maybe Mounds. But it definitely goes by Phalen, right by where I think it is. I strongly suspect we will get a Bruce Vento clue tonight.
I wish the clues didn’t have me changing my mind every 5 seconds.
It could be JJH - and odds of a small downtown park may have never been higher. That said if it is a Hill reference I would guess they are talking about Walnut Street, which falls just short of the mansion- and past old St Luke’s Hospital to Irvine Park.
My initial read on this one is about Chris Coleman, who helped champion the renovation of the Sam Morgan Trail which runs by but does not reach Downtown up hill. The city commissioned a study to see how much a direct connection to the Vento Trail would cost (good math) but have not started the project. How this relates to other clues is beyond me.
At this point I just hope these aren’t all references to trash they littered on the ground again.
I am a reformed fairgrounds truther. It is definitely not in any county, and is only subordinate to the State of MN.
MN Stat. 37.01 says among other things “Any part of the State Fairgrounds which is within the boundaries of a city or other political subdivision of the state is detached from the city or political subdivision.”
I don't think the streetcar noodle was bupkis. It's still a cornerstone of my Phalen theory. I didn't post it here because it was your theory but you can if you like. I thought it sounded better than any other explanation for that clue that I have heard. David B. Allison
That made it easier. Thanks for the maps. I pulled up the 1924 map, however his railroads went by many of the parks. It did seem to knock out the far western ones however.
Nice seeing you tonight at Shamrocks. My kids are always impressed when they meet you. Changing back to IMP for park pool clue #9. Thanks. Gotta stick with my gut, even though the clues seem like they are fitting multiple places. Even wondering about Pig's Eye Regional Park!
Why would there be a clue about James J. Hill this late in the game if it's at Harriet Island? I don't see it. Unless Hill had some connection to Harriet Island or Dr. Justus Ohage, or the water clues.
If you take the James J Hill house our coal manwhose house (lay down roots) is on Summit Ave.overlooking the bluff or hill if you willYou align his house (His Path) and it over looks Eagle Street Park Plaza (very tiny)Upper Landing (That has been mentioned)ANDHARRIET ISLAND ! If its on Harriet Island, I'm just gonna laugh
flippstermn@... (Mike Flipp)
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The Pioneer Press Treasure Hunt is part of the St. Paul Winter Carnival every year. While the prize can only go to one winner, The Allison Wonderland is dedicated to the community spirit of treasure hunting. Here, not only will you find out about the Pre-Dig Gig, the Rehash Bash, and various other social events, but we also discuss the clues here in a team effort to decipher them (albeit not always successfully). This is a place to discuss ideas respectfully, report on what's happening "on the ground", and provide each other with useful information. This is a public group so expect that anything posted will be seen by everyone.