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Only Terry, ThoseMedallingKids, KITCH, Ares and Clue Master have access to this thread.
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Hosts Only
Only Terry, ThoseMedallingKids, KITCH, Ares and Clue Master have access to this thread.
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there's an easy solution, cm. create a second non-mod account for biting back. of course that can lead to being bipolar.
We do need to address the trolling. Tim has tried it with me a time or two but I ignore him and he goes away.
I don't know what's gone on with Redbear and anyone else here, but I am saddened whenever anyone chooses to leave.
I don't know how we can deal with personal feelings here as those are apt to bubble up now and again.
And there's something wrong with being Bipolar?
We resent that. :wink:
tim and bear have been at each others' throats virtually for as long as i can recall. and the reality of the situation is that i wouldn't have reacted to anyone else any differently than i did tim, not even my own wife.
as both of them are 2 show up...
per sysop, thx1138 , and me
thx created it
I paid for it.
We actually asked THX to create it if he was going to be moderator again. Huh
ccm or kitch
they goofed and changed it to thx
now they are working on changing it to CCM
but its they are goofing with it...I don't know exactly...
49 min ago - 6 Jan 2006 12:17 pm New
From:
sysop[6]
To:
KITCH
Subj:
cooler crew folder
Tim wants the folder to be owned by a specific person and best if it's the one who paid for it. So we're making you owner of the cooler thread folder.
Now if something happens...I'll be to blame
I blame me.....
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Joe -------------------------
ares, "Hosts Only" #2197, 6 Jan 2006 9:21 am
just because we expect someone to behave badly, does that make that behavior acceptable? the reason i'm asking this is i came home from work and turned on cnn where they're talking abour ariel sharon, who is admittedly a controversial figure. i find it interesting that well-wishes are being poured into israel from all over the world. countries who don't necessarily see eye to eye with israel are sending well-wishes. they understand that whether they like sharon or not is not the issue. respect across the board is essential for world peace. however, there's an exception to all of the well-wishers. not too surprisingly, there's dancing in the streets of palestine. there's no contesting the fact that whether or not sharon survives this there will have to be some communication in the future between israel and palestine if there is to ever be peace in that part of the world. the behavior the citizenry is exhibiting is in no way conducive to the end result of peace.
granted, israel and palestine are a much larger scale than this, but i find it rather interesting that while the leadership is wishing sharon well, the citizenry finds the need to celebrate his potential demise. behavior which, i'd like to believe, most of the world expects out of them
and so i ask, is it acceptable for us to just turn away from the behavior because thats what we expect and its easier than dealing with it?
you say the cooler is changing. i just hope that the values of decency and respect don't stop being important to the cooler throughout that change. as moderators, it is our responsibility to ensure that this is an enjoyable place for people to be. if it isn't, eventually no one will want to be here. and that would be a sad day.
I disagree - It's much harder to turn away and let the situation fade.
sometimes its to take away the fuel.
sometimes its to feed it.
but as a fireman you better know which is the right thing to do or you will get burned.
its not 100% us...or anybody...
its money and we are an easy scapegoat.
guess I'll just talk 2 u guys at the park!
and I've got proof...
post by lilman Lilman - 01/06/2006 - 16:41
This is my take on the issue with Tim. He enjoys baiting and can hardly wait for someone to step up to the plate and take it. He especially knows who he can get to react.
This might be one thing to try.
Call it what it is.
Tim - You're baiting me. Go away.
And then do not respond further.
If he continues, there are other moderators who can step in and tell him to stop.
By taking the bait, it is simply adding fuel as that is exactly what he's after.
I'm not a king.
IÂ’m not a leader.
I wasn't elected to this post.
– I’m a cooler who is also a thread nanny… nothing more nothing less.
We have a responsibility to make this a good place but we are not here to oppress peopleÂ’s opinions.
In the reverse just because someone behaves badly does that give someone else the right to respond badly? Even if itÂ’s done under the pretenses of being a sane person?
Who decides whatÂ’s bad and whatÂ’s okay and even whatÂ’s sane and to what degree?
As itÂ’s been pointed out here more then once we are all adults and we live in an adult world. It goes both ways I guessÂ…. In how we initially act but in how we respond as well.
Yes we are an online community. But we differ from most other online communities in that we interact physically and have actual real life relationships with each other as well.
We have no control on what happens outside the cooler walls and if something inside the cooler walls is out of line we need to all talk as Mods to define that. But people are going to be people.
We are talking about real life here.
We could always use this too.
 :smile:
hmmm
was it me?? oh crap...I hope not..
btw...I'm not 100% sure yet...but I think non paying registored members can read the threads...can't post...
I need to confirm this and than get "sysop/tim" on that...
I'm not a king. IÂ’m not a leader. I wasn't elected to this post.
– I’m a cooler who is also a thread nanny… nothing more nothing less.
correct
We have a responsibility to make this a good place but we are not here to oppress peopleÂ’s opinions.
the problem is that in order to make this a good place, sometimes opinions have to be suppressed? take tim's rejoicing that redbear decided not to pay. sure they're at each others' throats. but if they're fighting all the time and we let it go, and one rejoices when the other decides to check out, are we really meeting the goal of making this a good welcoming place, or will seeing that turn people off to us? if the latter is the case then i think we have a duty in the name of the cooler to suppress those opinions, in much the same way that it's criminal to shout fire in a crowded theatre.
In the reverse just because someone behaves badly does that give someone else the right to respond badly? Even if itÂ’s done under the pretenses of being a sane person?
no it really doesn't. but slapping the hands of the respondent without slapping the hands of the original perpetrator does nothing to solve the problem, because responding is human nature. and if the only hands that are slapped in an given situation are those of the respondent, the community that will result is one where, the troublemakers will rule, the respondents to that trouble will be suppressed, and in the end you'll have a community of troublemakers. not really a conducive thing to our common goal of treasure hunting.
Who decides whatÂ’s bad and whatÂ’s okay and even whatÂ’s sane and to what degree?
that's our job here. we're something of a "representative dicatorship" that has responsibility to the masses for want of a better term. tim and redbear aren't a whole lot unlike you and me. except that we don't provoke each other publically. why not? because its bad behavior and we both know it. i think when it comes to deciding what's acceptable and what isn't we have to look at it from the point of what would newbies do? if the behavior would give them a bad opinion of the crew, its unacceptable.
As itÂ’s been pointed out here more then once we are all adults and we live in an adult world. It goes both ways I guessÂ…. In how we initially act but in how we respond as well.
absolutely. and that means that everyone has to act like an adult, not just those who aren't in our inner circles of friends. i guess in the end, knowing that you'd told him to cut it out, it would have been better for me to just have banned tim for it. would have been a lot fewer mouse clicks and typing on my part. but, again, that wouldn't have been acting like an adult either.
Yes we are an online community. But we differ from most other online communities in that we interact physically and have actual real life relationships with each other as well.
exactly.
We have no control on what happens outside the cooler walls
uh huh
and if something inside the cooler walls is out of line we need to all talk as Mods to define that.
uh huh
But people are going to be people.
We are talking about real life here.
and people, when provoked, respond. despite what we might dictate is acceptable behavior. if we slapped the hands of everyone who responded to being provoked, there'd be a folder with 20000 posts in it, and no one to add more.
In the end nothing can happen here without a vote from the mods as a whole so no single opinion really matters.
No stress :smile:
In the end things will come down to a group choice which I believe is how you all want it to be.
So when we agree to disagree things will still work out.
Now honestly I'm ready to hunt.
I hope each of you is having a good Monday.
if the answer is yes to either of them, then this place is dying.
Is it acceptable for people in the world to be at each others throats at anytime or place regardless?
Is it acceptable that Tim be allowed to have his own feelings and express those feelings?
It's not my place to answer these questions.
Peoples lives do not revolve around me. Subjects like that are well outside my place as a Mod and really have nothing to do with my role here. I'm not a board member of a club that is here to vote members out that don't meet my personal standards.
I will however as mod be making a point to take the high road in the regular threads with personal issues.
When I see a problem that needs addressing I will bring it in here where it belongs.
Which again brings up the point that what I think alone doesn't really matter. Everything has to be voted on by us all before solid actions can be taken.
of course not.
Is it acceptable that Tim be allowed to have his own feelings and express those feelings?
yes to the former, no to the latter, at least if we're trying to keep a welcoming community. now, if no one gives a shit about making this a place people want to come, that's fine. but i've been part of this group for far too long to let it slide into oblivion because of shit like this.
why can't you take a stand? when it came down to it, you told me that you told tim to knock it off. but this is something he's done not just with bear, but frequently when esd's decided to sign off too. if tim wants to rejoice bear's departure over in your clubhouse, that's fine with me. but it has no place over here. grow a spine, for crying out loud.
Which again brings up the point that what I think alone doesn't really matter.
well, i explicitly asked you.
not taking a stand is a good thing....
I am taking a stand. I'm standing here telling you that I will not tell people how to live, deal with each other and behave. If someone does something that violates the rules for the cooler threads then the Mods can vote on the issue and move on otherwise it doesn't apply.
It's a free country and honestly people here don't answer to anyone but themselves.
I'm not exactly sure why you are so concerned with my choice not to play master and commander. My entire point to you through all of this has been simple. A mod should lead by example. Doesn't matter what anyone does. You can't tell people to follow a set of rules all the time that you yourself consider conditional to your personal views on a situation in play.
well, i explicitly asked you.
yes you did ask me and it still doesn't matter when in the end we all have to vote.
It's clear we are going to disagree on this issue. I'm not going to change my view and I'm personaly not interested in debating it any further.
If the other mods have something to add then I welcome them to speak up.
I'm working with "sysop" on how to block nonpayers from reading most of the coolercrew theads....
I want this for few reasons....
ONE- I hate lurkers -sorry I don't like leeches.
TWO- I'd like to see more people support this AM its the reason we kinda killed PF ..I think the cooolers are the ones that put the extra strain on PF the created major issues and the snowball effect on Lance.
THREE- I personally don't want my private postings more then just the paying members...I'd like to share more than I do ...but Its not joeblow info.
FOUR - We alrdy paid $10...no more freerollers just reading our stuff. (same as one)
tim is currently working on this for us.
hopefully it gets done or we will need to go to invitaional threads only.