Something I learned today while reading Don Boxmeyer's A Knack for Knowing Things. Boxmeyer was born on the West End of St. Paul, not the West Side. Down the hill from Highland Park.
–adjective German. (in music) written in a minor key; minor.
–noun a female given name.
n. Slang
A woman companion of a gunman or gangster.
A woman prostitute.
 [Probably from the name Moll, nickname for Mary.]
Related Words for : moll
gangster's moll, gun moll
1567, female name, shortened form of Molly, itself familiar for Mary. Used from 1604 for "prostitute;" meaning "companion of a thief" is first recorded 1823. U.S. sense of "a gangster's girlfriend" is from 1923.
noun
the girlfriend of a gangster
Moll\, a. [G., fr. L. mollis soft, tender, elegiac. Cf. Molle.] (Mus.) Minor; in the minor mode; as, A moll, that is, A minor.
Note the German meaning..... Gee you could noodle that to Minnesota Music cafe next to Swede or minor key as in Chair-0-key!!!!!!
Going back to the Indian Mounds theories...... found this on the Dayton's Bluff historical site. Could be our King (Boreas) and Court references. Back then they called the Ice palace the Ice court.
"There is some confusion as to exactly where in Dayton's Bluff the Ice Court was located. It was definitely built in a playground in the Mounds Park area which has been variously identified as the Mounds Park Playground or the Dayton's Bluff Playground"
Xcel's not sounding too bad right now. Skating competition, Saints, Carnival activities, roomy, Candyland, old auditoruim changed to Xcel, RNC and protesters..........
I have a picture I used to use as my avatar during the carnival of two of my sisters and my Aunt Margaret sitting on the steps of that palace. Now I'm not sure where I've stored it.
Only one of those sisters is still alive, and I'm pretty sure she wouldn't remember where it was.
OK- I am at the library now. I have the Dillinger book which I can check out as well as a couple other books that I can bring home to pour through and see if there is anything for us. However-- I have limited time on this library computer and a book that could be helpful but I can NOT check out (ref only) called Theodore Hamm in Minnesota (yes, I am still stuck at SH in my head). So I am going to go through it and see if there is much to share....
first: another German immigrant Albert Scheffer also lived in Dayton's Bluff. In 1892, Hamm's only surviving son married Albert Scheffer's oldest daughter MARIE (a German doll? maybe a stretch...) The only son of that union, William Hamm Jr.(later kidnapped by the gangsters) became the 3rd pres of Hamm Brewing co. and the last member of the family to preside over their fortunes, etc.
You must not have hunted the last Phalen hunt... or looked where it was last year from any other angle other than where the clues said to walk in from.
I have missed days of searching in "the area" because I said "Naw... not safe enough".
It's not safe no matter where it is, in a clue 12 rush.
Either of these could be a "german doll", I am not sure if there is a way to fit to "the gangster's moll" but Hamm had a friemd Jacob Schmidt from Germany who emigrated and worked in breweries as well. Hamm hired him as his brewmaster-- the Hamms and Schmidts became close friends. The Schmidts had one child, Marie, nicknamed Mamie to avoid confusion with the other Maries. She became an inseparable companion to the youngest Hamm daughter Emma. Eventually the families' ties broke when Schmidt left Hamm to work at NORTH STAR brewery. He later bought Stahlmann Cave Brewery which became Jacob Schmidt Brewing Co.
So let's say we find a gangster's girlfriend of German descent (Gladys Berman for example). Are we realistically going to a place they once played? That will be some pretty deep history.
So let's ponder what the star crossed place could be where she once played. We've come across Hollyluck club or whatever it was called that sounds to be on Hidden Falls. There was the Castle Royal which would be by Harriet and Cherokee. There was a place called the Boulevards of Pairs on Lexington And University which wouldn't really be by any parks. There was a place called the Coliseum. I'm not sure where that was. There's the Commodore which at best is by Summit Overlook. Were there any places around Swede Hollow?
Also, thinking on timelines, I think the first part of the clue is referring to the 7th St. bridge which was built in 1884. Even if it means the railroad tracks, those were built before that even. All of which happened before the gangster era, so I don't think the two halves of the clue really happened at the same time despite the use of the word "while".
3 and 6 don't have to send you to the park... If you have every clue fitting your park... then you are reading something wrong. Usuaslly. How many clues typically point to a park?? Not all of them.
I don't have my map books with me at the library, so I am not yet sure if there is a way this ties into a park... but Alvin Karpis who would be THE gangster in my mind since he was behind Hamm's kidnapping had a moll named Dolores Delaney. (His girlfriend at the time of his death was named Nancy).
Dillinger's girlfriend was named Evelyn Frechette. I am ready to give up on this-- I'm not finding anything that really makes sense for the gangster's moll. :frown:
OK- I am home now. Sorry for any duplications of gangster/Hamm info to Tesser and others. I was just trying to get down what I could, while I could, from the library computer.
IMHO we take these clues all to literally! Not every word is meaningful and some phrases don't mean a darn thing when the explanations come out and even Box and Millet said punctuation and grammar are not usually significant. Point being that everything in a clue doesn't have to fit exactly. Usually just 1 or 2 things.
I think you can have a clue that seemingly is telling a story but you are suppose to look at key words or phrases that lead to things in or around the medallion location.
Searched Swede for about an hour as well as Cherokee..
The more I'm thinking about the "star-crossed" clue, the more I don't like the "North St. crosses the park" noodle.. it makes sense except for the fact that the clue says "Once played at this star-crossed place" which definitely implies some sort of actual dinner club or something, not the park.. ugh. don't even know where to go next :chagrin: :eek:
Those are from 1938. Pictures from our old family album. It was called an Ice Court according to the article. I wasn't born yet and my other two sisters must have been too young for the trip. There were five of us, all girls.
I pulled it up and will read it later. Waiting on the daughter so we can get a huntin'.
Reminds me of my father though. He didn't want to buy a TV until they got color but finally broke down and we got one in 1955. But he had them install the arial in the attic so the neighbors wouldn't know. :sillygrin:
One last thing that I read at the library... when the Hamms started to get civically involved in St. Paul, they donated the land for a triangular park near their home. It was called Cannon park (now Hamm park?). While it was not ideal for sports and games because of its location, the neighborhood kids made the most of it and played ball games there anyhow....
What bothers me is that this clue seems to reference specific people that when you figure it out lets you know the park. Problem is that nobody has figured out the people involved to determine the place. We're on clue 8, and this clue seems like it should be earlier on in the hunt. It reminds me of the last Battle Creek hunt, where they had some pretty obscure historical references in the latter clues with the easier clues earlier in the hunt. I wonder if it is because the park isn't all that huge, or if we are on the right track and the cluewriter is monitoring us and knows we're on the right track so they put this clue in there to throw us off for one or two more days.
Someone posted earlier about what does Springsteen have to do with the park?
Cluewriter's often use literary references from poems, songs, books, and even comicbooks(2004) to elude to things about where or how it's hidden.
Again don't be too literal in making everything fit just 1 or 2 keywords.
My hunch is today's clue should be looked at as 2 separate halves. (Even though it appears to be telling of one place in time)
The first part is referencing one aspect (possibly all the railways) and the second is referencing something else like they're trying to give a keyword.... still trying to figure this one out.
The talk of homophones further up the board combined with a discussion we were part of at dinner last night got me thinking again about the colic clue. The homonym would be COWLICK.
it resembles a profile with the park being the hair. If you lose the cowlick/colic, it would direct us away from the brewery/mansion part of the park. Don't know if this is valid or not, but thought I would share.
I've read so much gangster history in the past 15 hours. Ugh! I am not finding any one thing to help with the second part of the clue either. Thanks Andrea - for your run to the library and your research. I quit for now. Good luck all you noodlers and hunters!
Since we're on the subject of gangsters, if you have cable (first accept my apologies, heh), but there is an awesome Cities of the Underworld on demand right now that's all about San Francisco.. goes deep beneath Alcatraz to show the tunnels that some used to try to escape, also shows the nuclear missiles that could've started World War 3 and ended the world, as well as a couple other really interesting spots.. Highly recommended! Just watched it last night. It's on the History channel on demand.
So when we go back to King and Court.... not only did the King live up above with his family (in a total of 4 homes up there) but the Queen Scheffer did too-- quite the Court.
From slogging through all these clues I have some bit of info to put together. There is an Arbor St. in the West End area, off west 7th and Randolph, close to Palace Playground, by the Old Schmidt Brewery which is also on west 7th. That area was a German community, as my grandfather an immigrant lived there. These are just tidbits, but I am with OT it seems like each clue gets farther and farther from a park. :confused:
Beasts exposed... there are 3 street name A ,B, C streets
East B St = beasts????
point douglas =impale
Clue #2 has alot of BC references but here's how you can noodle "much of the history remains a mystery".....
In Street Where You Live book for Berland Place it describes of how the construction company named all the streets in the area and put them in alphabetical order. Dellridge and Hilldale mentioned in the list. According to Shirley Berland the names are without further significance.
http://www.amazon.com/gp/reader/0873513169/ref=sib_dp_pop_ex?ie=UTF8&p=S00P#reader-link
http://www.tcdailyplanet.net/article/2008/05/05/west-end-neighborhood-pride.html
moll 
–noun Slang. 1. gun moll.
2. Archaic. a prostitute
–adjective German. (in music) written in a minor key; minor.
–noun a female given name.
n. Slang
A woman companion of a gunman or gangster.
A woman prostitute.
 [Probably from the name Moll, nickname for Mary.]
Related Words for : moll
gangster's moll, gun moll
1567, female name, shortened form of Molly, itself familiar for Mary. Used from 1604 for "prostitute;" meaning "companion of a thief" is first recorded 1823. U.S. sense of "a gangster's girlfriend" is from 1923.
noun
the girlfriend of a gangster
Moll\, a. [G., fr. L. mollis soft, tender, elegiac. Cf. Molle.] (Mus.) Minor; in the minor mode; as, A moll, that is, A minor.
Note the German meaning..... Gee you could noodle that to Minnesota Music cafe next to Swede or minor key as in Chair-0-key!!!!!!
"There is some confusion as to exactly where in Dayton's Bluff the Ice Court was located. It was definitely built in a playground in the Mounds Park area which has been variously identified as the Mounds Park Playground or the Dayton's Bluff Playground"
Only one of those sisters is still alive, and I'm pretty sure she wouldn't remember where it was.
Now I'm going to try to find that picture.
first: another German immigrant Albert Scheffer also lived in Dayton's Bluff. In 1892, Hamm's only surviving son married Albert Scheffer's oldest daughter MARIE (a German doll? maybe a stretch...) The only son of that union, William Hamm Jr.(later kidnapped by the gangsters) became the 3rd pres of Hamm Brewing co. and the last member of the family to preside over their fortunes, etc.
I have missed days of searching in "the area" because I said "Naw... not safe enough".
It's not safe no matter where it is, in a clue 12 rush.
So let's ponder what the star crossed place could be where she once played. We've come across Hollyluck club or whatever it was called that sounds to be on Hidden Falls. There was the Castle Royal which would be by Harriet and Cherokee. There was a place called the Boulevards of Pairs on Lexington And University which wouldn't really be by any parks. There was a place called the Coliseum. I'm not sure where that was. There's the Commodore which at best is by Summit Overlook. Were there any places around Swede Hollow?
Also, thinking on timelines, I think the first part of the clue is referring to the 7th St. bridge which was built in 1884. Even if it means the railroad tracks, those were built before that even. All of which happened before the gangster era, so I don't think the two halves of the clue really happened at the same time despite the use of the word "while".
So feel good with your decision and dig on!
came out last week. About my dad and others who won't have a TV when the analog to digital conversion takes over.
But we got him a conversion box
I think you can have a clue that seemingly is telling a story but you are suppose to look at key words or phrases that lead to things in or around the medallion location.
The more I'm thinking about the "star-crossed" clue, the more I don't like the "North St. crosses the park" noodle.. it makes sense except for the fact that the clue says "Once played at this star-crossed place" which definitely implies some sort of actual dinner club or something, not the park.. ugh. don't even know where to go next :chagrin: :eek:
Reminds me of my father though. He didn't want to buy a TV until they got color but finally broke down and we got one in 1955. But he had them install the arial in the attic so the neighbors wouldn't know. :sillygrin:
Cluewriter's often use literary references from poems, songs, books, and even comicbooks(2004) to elude to things about where or how it's hidden.
Again don't be too literal in making everything fit just 1 or 2 keywords.
My hunch is today's clue should be looked at as 2 separate halves. (Even though it appears to be telling of one place in time)
The first part is referencing one aspect (possibly all the railways) and the second is referencing something else like they're trying to give a keyword.... still trying to figure this one out.
If you look at the map of swede hollow from above: http://maps.google.com/maps?setprefs&near=650+Payne+Avenue,St.+Paul,MN
it resembles a profile with the park being the hair. If you lose the cowlick/colic, it would direct us away from the brewery/mansion part of the park. Don't know if this is valid or not, but thought I would share.
cool cool stuff. what a lifestyle.
lose your cowlick = scalped
could be a general Indian reference to IM, BC, or Cherokee
There was something about the actual battle at BC where they describe scalping.
Beasts exposed... there are 3 street name A ,B, C streets
East B St = beasts????
point douglas =impale
Clue #2 has alot of BC references but here's how you can noodle "much of the history remains a mystery".....
In Street Where You Live book for Berland Place it describes of how the construction company named all the streets in the area and put them in alphabetical order. Dellridge and Hilldale mentioned in the list. According to Shirley Berland the names are without further significance.